Stroke of Insight Chapter 12 : MS vs PhD in USA

Written By: Adipto Ghosh Dastidar and Akankcha Singh

Edited By: Shreyoshi De

Arka: It’s my great pleasure and it’s my first and foremost duty on behalf of the JUSC members. We warmly welcome you all to this beautiful programme. I assure you that this programme shall be of full exuberance and excitement and will create some beautiful memories with us all. Without further adieu, I would like to start off the session right away.

After a long hiatus, we are back with the twelfth chapter of Stroke of Insight. It’s a pleasure to have our speaker Mr. Subhadeep Dutta with us today. Mr. Subhadeep Dutta is an experienced formulation scientist in Nanobiotechnology at SalioGen Therapeutics in USA and our very own alumni of Jadavpur University in Chemistry Department, from where he had completed his Bachelor in Chemistry. He had completed his Masters from IIT Bombay and Ph.D from Arizona State University. He now leads a diverse research team that has led to over seven publications, more than ten scientific talks, fifteen poster presentations and even one patent. He has made great strides in the field of science and made numerous contributions to biotechnology. We are very grateful to have you here.

With this I would like to introduce the other host of the interview, Adipto Ghosh Dastidar.

Adipto: Hello everyone, I am Adipto Ghosh Dastidar and I am a member of SOI and Mutate team of Science Club, and I’m also a student of Civil Engineering Department of Jadavpur University. I thank everyone for giving me the opportunity to host this interview. I would like to start off by asking Mr. Dutta to give a brief introduction of himself.

Subhadeep Dutta: First of all, thank you JUSC for giving efforts to organize this programme. I think it’s a great initiative not only to connect pass out seniors with the current batches in JU, but also for providing a platform for the current students to interact with them and talk to because we have already graduated and followed up on our careers. But we can still assist you as a knowledge source with the help of these kinds of platforms.

So just to give you a little bit of background, I completed my Bachelors in Jadavpur, after which I did my Masters from IIT Bombay, followed by my Ph.D in Arizona State University. I am working as a scientist in a biotech company in Boston, Massachusetts. My main work is pretty much interdisciplinary. Even though I am a trained chemist, I work with a lot of engineers and medical professionals as well. Once you go higher up in your career, you will realize that different fields like physics, chemistry, biology and engineering go hand in hand and you need all of these skill sets to finally solve a bigger problem.

Arka: Definitely. So I will be asking some of the questions which I have got from the YouTube chat. One of the questions asked is, “How is the Ph.D or MS program in Japan?”

Subhadeep: I would say I am not hundred percent sure about Japan but US has a very good system in the sense that you just need to clear your GRE and the IELTS and then you apply to the universities of your choice based on your score and even though mailing professors and faculties is not a compulsory thing, you can do it in advance so that it helps you while transitioning into foreign for higher studies.

Whereas, most European institutes have a personalized system wherein you directly mail the faculties and they tell you what’s the scenario and how the fellowship is going to be and if they have the vacancies in their labs to accommodate you as a PhD or a Masters student,i.e, it’s a one-on-one interaction. I am not a hundred percent sure but I would assume even in the case of Japan, they do not have a centralized system like the US. In the US, the system is very straightforward once you get to know how to prepare your CV or your resume and how to write your Statement of Purpose. In most cases, for Europe and Asia, you can apply to the university of your choice after clearing IELTS. When the professor gives you the approval that he or she can take you as a Masters or a PhD student, then they kind of guide you for fellowships if there is any.

Adipto: Thank you for such a detailed answer. Your words will definitely be a rich source of information for students who are planning to seek out countries other than the US for going into higher studies. Can you please explain the process for directly applying for Ph.D in US and other countries?

Subhadeep Dutta : Sure, so for applying for direct PhD in US , the application mainly consist of ,you know ,as I said, GRE and TOEFL, these two exams which is better if you take it by December .For example, in most of the cases ,the university application deadlines are in December or in January for admission in fall which is basically in JULY-AUGUST time frame. You also need to prepare your SOP which is basically ‘STATEMENT OF PURPOSE ’and for PhD application ,there is one more thing which is necessary which is called ‘RESEARCH INTEREST’ where you basically talk about “What is your Research Interest?” . I would say it’s not super critical. SOP is really personal and sometimes really essential and that’s one of the critical things they evaluate . If you have some kind of research experience you can talk about that but they really don’t expect you to have a lot of Research experience to be honest with you . Instead of that, what they try to see is “what motivated you to do PhD?” because that requires a lot of research for several years.

Other than these two things, the most important thing is the “Letter of Recommendation” or LOR . So, the letter of recommendation I would say you should target the faculties which you think will give you the best recommendation letter for you. Sometimes aspirants make the mistake of trying to go for the best faculty thinking that having a Letter Of Recommendation from them would make a really good impact. But when Universities review your application ,they really don’t have time to see who is writing the letter and how great he or she is, or whether it’s a junior faculty or a senior faculty-they review what is written on it and it’s really important to choose those faculties who will write a great recommendation letter for you .Another thing I would say is, as I just told that PhD is very interdisciplinary when you go higher in your career- as I said ,I am a chemist by training but in my PhD , most of my research is in Chemical Engineering and in the field of biomedical engineering so whenever you are applying for your PhD think about that.

Arka : That was a very insightful answer and I guess we have some more questions from our audience .So Rijit says how much weightage is given to your GPA while applying for Masters or PhD in the US?

Subhadeep Dutta : Right. So, it’s another great question. So, I would say when you are applying for a PhD, it’s important but it’s not very important because during your PhD application, your GRE and TOEFL score, your SOP, your GPA and your letter of recommendation, play an equal role. For masters I would say GPA has more weightage because LOR and SOP have less significance in this case.As a PhD, I would say they try to emphasise more on the research side than they do for masters candidates. Even though your GPA tells something but honestly, it doesn’t really matter much for when you go for higher education. For example, you will have a GPA even when you do your PhD but the only things that matter for getting a job in the industry of academia after PhD are the skills that you have learned during your period, what research you have done, and the publication(s) you have made. In the US there is a 4 point scale, you have to convert your 10 point scale to 4 point scale. Usually any GPA over 3 is well taken here. However, I would say there is no strict limit or boundation on that.

Adipto: Okay we have actually quite heard that if someone goes to the US for higher studies, he /she might face a lot of cultural differences like, have you faced any difficulty? I would like to ask if you faced any cultural difficulties when you went to the US?

Subhadeep Dutta : Right. It’s a great point.I think it’s really important to start networking with your seniors. You are in a completely different country where food habits are different, your sleeping cycle will change, you will have to do your chores by yourselves, you will have to buy your own groceries and cook for yourself-things you probably never did while pursuing your Bachelor’s or Master’s in India. In some cases, if you are a PhD student you have to work as a Teaching Assistant or TA. So, there would be a lot of these new things which would be coming into place specially in your first semester.

Fortunately, I was lucky in the sense that I was in Arizona State University as it is well known for housing a substantial number of International students. Most universities also have an International Students Union which basically kind helps you to make connections. For example, if biomedical engineering has some Indian students who can help you or make friends and you just connect and the group stays forever, right? So, that’s why I think when you are looking at universities, reaching out to seniors and getting to know the culture is important. As I said, ASU is very famous for having international students; for instance, almost 50% of my batchmates were international students, with many of them being Indian. It is not that the ‘American culture’ is dominating you, you have other cultures to know and talk to them and make new friends and you will definitely have Indian friends and communities which you can join. I would say the first semester gets really busy exploring that.

Arka: That was very interesting and I think most of the questions have been answered and there are a few more questions from Agniva , he is saying that as a student of UG2, he wants to pursue Masters or PhD under DAAD. What’s your advice on this?

If I am not wrong, DAAD is a really interesting program but I don’t have much knowledge about that as I never applied. DAAD is mainly a fellowship to do a PhD or a Masters in Germany and there are some good research programmes under DAAD. So DAAD is an association which basically connects German universities where you can pursue different degrees and while DAAD is quite competitive, it is achievable. Documents like SOP, LOR and Research Interest play a critical role during evaluation for DAAD fellowships. I think there might be an IELTS requirement too.

Adipto: I would like to ask you that is there any difference between integrated MS+PhD and non-integrated programs?

Subhadeep Dutta : So I think you are asking MS+PhD versus a regular PhD or a regular Masters. So, there are definitely pros and cons for the integrated MS+PhD. The duration is shorter wherein you can get 2 degrees within 5 to 6 years and it helps especially if you continue your research in the same lab or in the same research area. When you start the program, you gather your skill sets within the first 2 years and you finish your coursework and get your Masters degree, and you can finish your PhD early because you are already in that same lab or in the research field. So I would say the main research happens in the last 3 years. You know if you break the PhD in 2 + 3, I would say the last 3 years are really productive as you are doing new research, you are writing those papers of publications, you are presenting in different conferences in all those things. So doing a Masters+ PhD is basically giving those 2 years to you when you know you are using that towards your masters, but also you are saving your time as a PhD as well. So that really helps for those integrated programs.

Arka: Thank you so much. It was a really great answer from your side. Priyojit from YouTube is asking you, “Should I start research projects under university professors in second year? If yes then, how should I manage semester exams and research work simultaneously?”

Subhadeep: I think this is a tough question to answer but surely, time management is a great thing to master and which all of us will be required to do in every point of our career because we are doing multiple things. Basically you will have to do undergraduate research, do your coursework and prepare for your application for Masters and Ph.D-all at the same time. When you are actually doing your Masters or Ph.D, you have to actually do the coursework and research simultaneously. Also during the end of the course, you have to look for jobs and prepare for interviews. So all the time, we are managing different things, not only focusing on our studies or finishing exams that we used to do in the very beginning of Bachelors.

But I would say what really helps is having a good schedule but I would say in your second year or third year, you will have to definitely focus a little bit on your course. Those are important. But try to split your week in a way that you can spend one to two hours on your research. For example, if your research needs straight two to three hours, then probably you should restrict the number of days you are spending behind it. Let’s say two days a week you will spend on the research. Now let’s say at the end of fourth year when you are preparing for job interviews in India, you are also trying to apply for higher education in foreign universities. Try to find time during the weekends for learning about how to apply foreign universities for Masters or PhD or preparing for job interviews and try to maintain that. It’s not something that you can just ramp up in one night like you do for your semester exams. That’s why I would say to give yourself a good amount of time and start preparing early. That’s why you should split your week in a way that you would assign time for these things and you should be able to maintain this practice for a few months.

Arka: Okay, so that was a really profound answer from your end. So Rijit is asking, “Whom should the Letter of Recommendation typically come from to catch the eye of the university?”

Subhadeep: Typically the Letter of Recommendation should be coming from someone who works in the faculty, it can be someone who you’ve worked under during undergraduate research or someone who taught you as a part of the curriculum, or it can be someone from the Department who might not have taught you any course but may know you as a student of the department. If you have done a project or a research internship in a different institute, the faculty you’ve worked under can also provide you with a letter of recommendation.If you have the chance to do an industrial internship as an undergraduate student, your manager can write you a Letter of Recommendation. You should approach someone who has seen you as a student or as a researcher and can write a good LOR for you. You should also be aware of the kind of person you are approaching and what kind of impression you have left on them.

Arka: This is quite an intriguing answer. I have another question from YouTube. Someone is asking, “Would you prefer working in the R&D of a private company or as a researcher in academia?”

Subhadeep: I think this is a great question and the concept comes from how we see things in India. In India, we usually think that having an academic job is very secure in the long run. But in the US, jobs in both academia and private companies are relatively secure.

But there is a huge difference in the job culture if you are going to a big company versus if you are going to a startup. In big companies, they have a well-established infrastructure and there is a well-set line of work. In startups however, this line of work changes regularly. As for start-ups, there is always an uncertainty of things going downhill. But I would say that in the US, at least for the field of pharmaceutical sciences or biotech, it is quite manageable to get a job if anyone gets laid off because the demand is very high and I would say that especially since Covid, the importance of pharmaceutical sciences and biotech has grown manyfold. That’s why even though tech companies are facing a recession, I have not seen any drastic effect in the pharmaceutical science or biotech sector.

Adipto: Thanks for providing such valuable pieces of information. Well, many of my batchmates actually wish to pursue higher studies in physics or chemistry. So what might be the difficulties they might face in changing streams from engineering to basic sciences? Can you please elaborate on that?

Subhadeep: Sure. I don’t think there will be any kind of difficulty because most of the times we face difficulties when we go the other way round i.e., say if I have to go to engineering from basic sciences, then I would have to face certain difficulties as there are certain principles of engineering that one must learn. For example, if someone goes from chemical engineering to chemistry, then there won’t be much difficulty. Rather, I would like to point out one thing here that I had learnt during my Ph.D in Arizona State University is that doing a PhD in a basic science subject like biology or chemistry or biochemistry or mathematics is a more economically reliable choice. Because as I mentioned, during the initial few years of Ph.D you get to do work as a TA, which means that you need to take some classes which are not going to be super difficult for you because in most of the cases, you have already taken that class yourself and you know the subject. So because of that, you won’t be facing any financial issues. Irrespective of the undergraduate degree, the students in the US are taking these basic science classes as an undergraduate. But if you go for a Ph.D degree in engineering, they will most likely provide you one year TA support. After that, your research advisor has to pay you.

Hence, you need to find a research advisor who has funds. Other than that, in terms of technical knowledge, I don’t think there will be much difficulty for having a different undergraduate degree. Even though I did my undergraduate in chemistry, my research was mainly focused on biomedical engineering, nanotechnology and chemical engineering. So the combination of my research was quite interdisciplinary. Whatever I had learnt in my Bachelors and in my Masters did help me but I had to learn a lot of new things and that’s what will happen with any Ph.D.

Adipto: Yeah that’s right. Staying updated is definitely the most important thing for any person who is involved in the academia. So with this I am moving on to the next question. You have done your Masters from IIT Bombay and you PhD in USA. I would like to ask that if you had the opportunity to go back in time and choose whether you want to do your Masters from the USA or India, then which option would you choose?

Subhadeep: I would say that the one constraint during that time was the economic situation. As I just mentioned, most of the time the Masters degree in the USA is not funded and you have to really struggle for these scholarships. So that’s why I had to stay in India back then for my Masters. But in the US, the research environment is quite advanced. Even a person doing a Bachelors degree in the US is getting good research exposure in labs. So that’s where the foundation begins. Most of us in India don’t get the privilege to get this level of research exposure like in the US.

So in my case, doing a Masters in India at that time was comparatively a more feasible option. To be honest, I think it was a good decision for me because I went away from home for the first time in my life and got used to that environment of living away from home. During my Bachelors, I was living with my friends and family. By doing my Masters in IIT Bombay, I actually underwent a gradual and slower transition in environment as opposed to the sudden change I would have experienced if I had gone to the US right after my Bachelors. So when I came to the US to do my Ph.D, I was quite used to living away from my family. So that helped a little bit as well, you know, psychologically, you know, getting used to that.

Adipto : Okay, so you mentioned that the person who might want to pursue higher education abroad can face some difficulties regarding funding of their course. Can you suggest how we can maximize our chances of getting our course fully funded?

Subhadeep Dutta: Every country has a different system- especially, higher education in the US is very different from Europe. As I said, for the US, doing a PhD and Masters is an easy process. For PhD, getting funded is quite easy, especially for basic sciences. For example, in my university, I had 6 years of TA support for my PhD that fully covered my expenses. These are the things students should plan early and that’s why it is important to email the faculties beforehand in case they have vacancies for students for paid positions. For Germany, there are a number of scholarships DAAD and the one offered by the Max Planck Society. Most European colleges and institutes have their own scholarship which you have to apply individually. It's just a lot of work, and that’s why I said once you clear your GRE, the US application is very straightforward and you just you know manage your SOP and find your letter of recommendation. Other than that you just have to contact different universities. Well, if you like to be assured, you should start emailing professors who you think share some research interest with you.

Arka: Thanks a lot. That was great information from your side and I would like to ask that in this, yeah, we know that getting scholarships for MS programs are a little bit on a tougher side as compared to the PhD program. So what’s your take on it?

Subhadeep Dutta : Right, so yes it’s tough definitely you know, it is not 100% guaranteed that you will be getting a scholarship. For example, in an unfavourable scenario, in case you are not successful in getting a scholarship , you can start your degree and then start looking for on-campus jobs. As a university student ,you are allowed to do on-campus jobs. A variety of jobs are available on campus starting from working in the cafeteria to working as Research Assistant-you can apply in any of these. For example, in my university, master's students also work as teaching assistants in some cases.

Arka: Okay, that was a very nice answer from your side and I guess a lot of questions have been answered and I think it’s been a wonderful time having you with us. Thanks a lot for sharing your valuable insights. I’m sure our audience enjoyed it thoroughly because it’s quite evident from the overwhelming performance and their response on our own YouTube channel.

However, the time has come to an end for the session. I hope to have you with us again in the future. And a lot of questions that haven’t even been asked have also been answered by you. Thank you so much for providing such valuable insights.

Subhadeep Dutta: Sure, it was very nice talking to you guys and I really appreciate again for the effort of the Jadavpur University Science Club and if anyone of you have an interest in the field of “Pharmaceutical Sciences” or in “Biotechnology” especially, you know, you can reach out to me or I can connect you to others if I know anyone on your feed of interest. So, feel free to connect with me if you like.

Thank you so much guys and good luck!